Bi-wiring - Yea or nay

[Wizardofoz]

You need to measure with something like an LCR bridge that is more a test lab type of equipment.

I use a Fluke pm6303

[jb]

I am using a fluke multimeter, of course if you have access to agilent range of multimeter that will give you more accurate test result.

[jb]

I think Wizardofoz has a more accurate impedance analyzer than what I have, may be bring u cable at his place and have a measurement and see what resistance it give? may be we all can bring our different brand of speaker cable and test out at his place and list the test results of all those brand spk cable... that will be interesting...to see what kind of impedance it measured...

As the fluke PM6303 allow measurement of resistance, inductance and capacitance, and if we only do measurement of less than 100 KHz frequency it will give quite accurate results.

[jb]

attached below is common copper AWG gauge and measured resistance FYI... so a 1mm copper wire will have 0.021 Ohm per meter...



source: http://www.daycounter.com/Calculators/AWG.phtml

[Wizardofoz]

My fluke is old and probably out of calibration by now and I also have an Agilent multimeter too that does a reasonable job of of LCR too. Not sure how to set the frequency range as I think it's maybe fixed at 1KHz

I did at one time do some speaker cable tests on a test cable set that watchdog did some years ago.

While listening tests are so subjective, test equipment doesn't always tell the whole story either as components will often interact differently when combined

[jb]

I agree speaker cable design is half science and half art, what is measured as good engineering results may not sound good...even for power amplifier does low distortion really matter? I have heard some amp spec at 0.3% distortion that sound better than those spec at 0.001% distortion...
or change a power cord and it affects the total system sound, this kind of effect cannot totally explain by engineering fact...

[Francis Huang]

Sometimes too much a bandwidth will show more things, both gd and bad
Sometimes certain 'roll offs' is just what the sym need to sound the way we want it too

I agree speaker cable design is half science and half art, what is measured as good engineering results may not sound good...even for power amplifier does low distortion really matter? I have heard some amp spec at 0.3% distortion that sound better than those spec at 0.001% distortion...
or change a power cord and it affects the total system sound, this kind of effect cannot totally explain by engineering fact...

[jb]

Found a LCR meter at reasonable price at Aliexpress of US$294.37, able to measure resistance down to 0.0001 ohm to 99 Mohm, C= 0.01pF to 99999uF,and L=0.01uH to 99.99KH.... value for money just don't know the product quality...But if u want to DIY speaker cable, interconnect cable or crossover circuit coil design, this will be a good tool to have. The normal multimeter resistor reading only limit to 0.1 or 0.01 OHM for most low price model , but this model can read down to 0.0001 ohm!

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Tonghui-TH2811D-LCR-Meter-Bench-0-2-10Khz-Lab-Digital-electrical-bridge-inductance-New/1800579_32366821078.html

[jb]

yes, the two set of speaker terminals are connected to the same amplifier output in parallel. For most well design speaker cable the resistance is below 0.001 Ohm so is a small fraction of the actual speaker impedance of 4 or 8 Ohm. Thus I believe the benefit of bi wiring is from the extra inductance or capacitance of the second set of speaker cable that improve the sound and also isolated path of current driving woofer and tweeter circuit.

Since you have the SPICE tool, curious to know if it show the above? Only know of NAIM gear which have their own NACA requirement to induce capacitance.

And your mention of the  0.001 Ohm resistance rating for the cabling - what length and thickness is that with reference to? Even better if you can provide info regarding the make and model of such a low resistance cable. Even silver cabling I measured using a multimeter is about 0.2 Ohm per meter.

Resistance wise, there is this article at http://www.audioholics.com/audio-video-cables/speaker-cable-gauge

Hi WCK, I can measure your silver cable for you if u want to? you measured at 0.2 Ohm is because you multimeter resolution is at 0.1 Ohm , so will not be able to measure anything below 0.1 Ohm. And if you have speaker cross over also can be measure to look at the frequency response.

[Marin0]

Hi all,

This is my first post reply
I quote reply from my friends who are professional in this area -

When it comes to speaker wires , they do make a difference to the sound. Wires have resistance that should be minimized but also they have inductive and capacity component which do not have great effect with smaller lengths. Cable should not be rolled (inductive component) or too close in parallel (capacity component).

 Another advise -
Bi-wire and single wire give us different effect. Bi give you maybe more stage feel and single maybe more musical.

I just upgraded from single wire to bi-wire and very pleased with the sound. 

cheers



 

[jb]

Welcome Marin0, yes speaker cable do make a difference in the hifi system sound. Also as you go higher up the tier of branded speaker cable, they will reduce the cable resistance to below 0.00X ohm with some XX inductance. So far I can only measure the cable resistance and inductance but not the capacitance as that will need an equipment like an audio network analyzer, with some curve fitting software to get an accurate RLC model of the cable.

 http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/usedequipment/hewlettpackard/networkanalyzers/3577a.htm

great that you enjoy your bi-wire speaker experience and looking forward for u to continue  share what you learn and experience on hifi...